127 thoughts on “Where are the real journalists? 15 questions for Amnesty”

1. Maybe we should rename it Amnesty Palestine International, or Palestine Amnesty.

   It has been obsessively anti-Israel for years (Often sliding into Antisemitism), but it needs donations etc and what better way than a high profile attack report on Israel to increase publicity

2. who said this about Israeli ” democracy” ?

   ” It defeats every major purpose of a democracy.” ?

   1. Benny Hill?

      1. close

3. This Rabbi just made a generous blessed donation to Amnesty and urge Jews (and people of all faiths and none) to support this fine organisation.

   And here’s your regular reminder that Israel is STILL an apartheid state.

   Thank you and blessings.

   .

   1. “Mayer” of London? Another hater abusing freedom of speech.

      1. clearly and comically and Iranian clown

4. The only method of David is to try to attack the attacker.
   Which is an implicit admission of not being able to deal with the merits.

   To call Israel an “apartheid state” has actually a political meanin, which Zionists can perfectly get: it just means that the so called “status quo” about Israel and the Palestinians is a crime against humanity, not a “territorial dispute”.

   You can call it whatever you like, if you don’t like “apartheid” you can call it “John”: the message is: “John” is a crime, not legitimate behaviour, who perpetrates “John” is a criminal.
   Not Amnesty, but rather all human rights organizations, the UN and the ICC, International law and very concept of “human rights” are going to align to those principles.

   The “status quo” has to be dealt in terms of absolutes, condemning oppression now, unequivocally and unconditionally. Not through “understanding” the oppressor.

   Not trhough waiting for a phantom “two states solution” in the future, but claim rights immediately and independantly from any political formula.

   That the paradigm is not about “negotiating s compromise”, but about affirming Palestinian rights unconditionally, recognize the injusticeagainst them and condeming the 73-year long denial of their rights.

   https://youtu.be/wYahHBMZ5nE

   1. What you are arguing is a complete nonsense. If A wants to destroy B and B sets in places restrictions to defend itself – then by using the formula you rely on above – all A has to do is not negotiate, not budge and continue trying to destroy B. Eventually everyone – all your wonderful NGOs will look on the restrictions that B has set in place and work to undermine them. Thus assisting A in its goal. It has nothing to do with human rights. It is all about stupidity.

      1. A does not want to “destroy B”. That is the interpretation on the part of B: Israel equates the claim of Palestinian rights as a quest for its own “destruction”.

         In fact, Palestinians don’t want the “destruction of Israel” – they wouldn’t be happy if Israel was hit by an asteroid or conquered and settled by Turks, Celts or Nigerians – what they want is to have their own rights, which imply their own power on Israel, not to “destroy it”.

         Israel fear of “distruction” does not stem from a Palestinian intent or action, but merely from their existence. They are a demographic threat to Jewish supremacy even in its current territory. Israeli Jews are afraid that the state of Israel as it is won’t be able to exist as a Zionist “state of the Jews”, if Palestinians have their rights recognized.

         I don’t believe Israel will ever, ever recognize Palestinian rights voluntarily.

         1. Beyond congratulating you for what was either your successful gender-reassignment surgery OR deciding to add an “E” to your name to not be troll-recognized (the odds of you and the removed tumor we knew as Gabriel-no-e being different people are around 0.000000001%), all that needs to be said is that much like your current far-Left non-human rights adore, you didn’t make a single valid point. Not one of them. That’s zero if you need to count it out Gabby 😉

         2. Oh Gabriel, more lies.

            Many Palestinian leaders have called for the complete destruction of Israel. So have Palestinian terror groups. We have the evidence. This is not up for argument. What you do is hide behind the word ‘Palestinians’ – because guess what – the ordinary Palestinian in the street probably doesn’t seek the destruction of Israel. So you use him to reject the truth. But ‘he’ isn’t part of the equation because he remains powerless inside his own community. His world is run by the extremists – and these are the ones Israel must consider first. Which is why we have so many problems – why the wall is there – why the checkpoints exist etc.

            As for the ‘demographic threat’ – therein lies another falsehood that propagandists love to spread. What bothers people is that there is an area with a Jewish majority. If the only problem was human rights – we would have seen two states long ago. But the Arab leaders were not interested in human rights – they only wanted to get rid of the area with a Jewish majority. It is why no Palestinian state was set up before 1967. You can even see this desire to get rid of the Jewish majority inside the Apartheid claims. Read Adalah’s list of problematic laws. If you applied the same standards to the UK, then the UK would be an Apartheid state because Xmas is a national holiday and the states emblems contains the christian cross. But that isn’t racism or apartheid – it is a democracy – in which the culture and will of the majority carries some sway. Amnesty doesn’t ask for equality in Israel – it asks for inequality. Amnesty is saying that the 20% should have as much of an equal shaping of a state’s being as the 80%. This isn’t about human rights or personal freedom – it is an attack on democracy. This is why the Nation State Law, which had nothing to do with individual rights annoyed them so much. The logic behind it is ridiculous. It means France for example should place all of the wishes of its Islamic minority group as ‘equal’ to all of the wishes of its largest majority. Yes, of course it sounds ludicrous – because it is – but that is EXACTLY what those pushing the ‘Apartheid’ smear onto pre 1967 Israel are doing. They are arguing to depower the majority. It has no susbstance – but there are clearly enough stupid people who buy into the argument. Aligning themselves with antisemites and radical Islamic terrorists as they do so.

5. Following is what the person who literally wrote the book on Israel’s purported apartheid said in a 2007 interview with Wolf Blitzer of CNN (I refer to ex-U.S. President Jimmy Carter, author of “Palestine: Peace Not Apartheid”):

   “I’ve never alleged that the framework of apartheid existed within Israel at all, and that what does exist in the West Bank is based on trying to take Palestinian land [sic] and not on racism. So it was a very clear distinction.”
   http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0701/21/le.01.html

   He further stated:
   “The book has nothing to do with what’s going on inside Israel which is a wonderful democracy”
   https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palestine:_Peace_Not_Apartheid#cite_note-LifeAndTimesTranscript-5

   Today, CNN puts things this way: “Amnesty accuses Israel of apartheid, is labeled antisemitic in return.” This implies that “apartheid” is a carefully analyzed charge, while “antisemitism” is a weaponized charge. Readers are thus primed against understanding that the reverse is true.

6. Gabriel

   You are such an ignorant dingbat
   .
   The conflict has never really been about territory, except to the western,”useful idiots’, who manifest their hatred against Jews by trying to destroy the world’s only Jewish State.

   This conflict has always been about religion and ideology. According to Muslims, a territory that has previously been under Muslim domination may never be ruled by any other group, and especially not by the ‘dhimmi’ Jews

   At least you are now revealing your true ‘lefty liberal neo-fascists’ leanings (my term used to describe the intolerant so-called progressives of both left and right)

7. Mickey Mouse?

   1. even closer

8. 1.Your point is self-defeating, David, if you applied a fraction of your own logic to yourself you would have to dismiss your own reports. You wrote “reports” attacking Amnesty International as well as all other major international and Israeli Human Rights groups, and you are an extreme pro-Israel and anti-Palestinian propagandist: where exactly is your “neutrality”, if you deem it necessary for credibility?

   Attacking the person reporting is a fallacy that shows an intent to avoid the merits. If you had convincing arguments and your opponents had no case, any point about neutrality of the people involved would be irrelevant, you would just focus on disproving their case. The point is that you don’t actually have to agree with the conclusions of the report: there is freedom of thought. But what is outstanding, is that you (and also Israeli authorities and pro-Israel groups) do not try to argue or disprove the merits. They only attempt to stigmatize the reporter.

   2. A repetition of the same point. Besides, what is wrong with one person being specialized in only one topic? Being geopolitics or human rights, this is normal.

   3. The same argument again. Adding some more circular reasoning. Consider an alternative hypothesis: those human rights activists had been aware that Israel perpetrates apartheid, simply because it does, and they happened to have noticed it as something obvious, since they are human rights activists, and possibly interested in the Palestinian occupation.

   4. , 5. More of the same, repeated attempt to talk about something else.

   6. Amnesty didn’t change any definition. In fact, Amnesty was just pretty late in acknowledging reality, in coming to the same, obvious conclusion that had been reached already by a number of Human Rights groups and other organizations before, Yesh Din, B’Tselem and HRW among them.

   But also the city council of Bologna, the town were I live, has declared to embrace BDS years ago.

   A number of personalities and institutions have declared Israel an apartheid state, including the UK Labour Party, Jimmy Carter, Desmond Tutu, John Kerry, Benjamin Pogrund and so many others.
   If I were you I would consider that maybe if all these people point a finger at a naked king, it could be that maybe it’s just because there is a naked king.
   Or, everybody is part of the same Antisemitic conspiracy?

   7. The situation of Israel is actually caused by Zionism; and the fact that Palestinians are enemies of Israel is the same reason why Bosnian Muslims are enemies of Serbian nationalists, that is because Zionism is an ethnic cleansing program and a denial of Palestinian rights. But let’s forget about these details for a moment and let’s focus on what Israel does: are Israel’s actions actually motivated by security needs? This is an Israeli claim, but the answer to the question whether such claim is credible, is: no.

   Israel might have maintained that it had to control the Palestinian territories just for security reasons, and be credible, if Israel had not built the settlements, if it had not annexed East Jerusalem, if it had admitted that the territories are occupied and Israel had no sovereignty on them, if it had accepted the International legal consensus that the pre ‘67 green line cannot be violated, and if it had built its wall inside its recognized borders, rather than on the occupied territory.

   In theory there could be measures that are necessary for security reasons. But nothing could justify the settlements. And nothing can justify the land grabbing, the ethnic discrimination in family reunifications, the demolishing of houses or disruption of civilian activities, and the demographic operations carried on everywhere, including inside Israel and outside the Occupied territories.

   8. The claim that Amnesty does not deal with other human rights crisis around the world is manifestly false. Just look how many hours were spent just to investigate and document human rights abuses in one prison in Syria: https://saydnaya.amnesty.org/en/about.html

   The campaign of AI in Syria had consequences: there were even people prosecuted and convicted. In fact Amnesty was more successful in Syria than in Israel.

   9. Desmond Tutu famously declared that the Israeli apartheid is actually “worse” than the South African one. Anti-Apartheid activist Benjamin Pogrund admitted that Israel was running an apartheid system de facto and the only missing step was a formal declaration of that.

   10. Most non-Jew Arabs in Israel define themselves as Palestinians and consider themselves as a part of one Palestinian nation.

   Zionists are not in a good position for talking about identity appropriation.

   11. A personal elucubration by David, who uses this curious term “flag waiver”. It is also curious that you mention India, since this may show that in fact the real issue has little to do with flags. In fact, the flag of India would have hardly bene a concern for Amnesty international for many decades, when India used to be a “normal” country. But rather, it is the fact that, over the last 10 years India has been ruled by a racist party that promotes ethnic-religious nationalism, that made ideological support for the governing party start to look sinister.

   Human rights means love for universalism and rejection of racism, human rights are not compatible with ethnic nationalism.

   12. Actually Amnesty International has mentioned Pakistan 197 times in dedicated news issues https://www.amnesty.org/en/location/asia-and-the-pacific/south-asia/pakistan/

   13-14-15. No facts. Just more personal speculation and judgements.

   1. Gabriel – the difference between research and propaganda – is that research is conducted thoroughly, with the intention of finding out whether something is actually true or not. Propaganda has no interest in truth, but grabs at convenient pieces of data in order to shape them in whichever way is needed. Both research and propaganda rely heavily on the same data sets.

      You are a propagandist and nothing more. You grab selectively and push things that simply are not true.

      The attack on Amnesty has a simple premise. Amnnesty have judged Israel. It claims it is unbiased. Like any judicial system – fairness and legality sit at the root of all judgement. Amnesty is not fit to be a judge – and it is absolutely right, that this should be the focus of the discussion. Just as all kangaroo courts before it. You would not accept a judgement from a court led by a judge who lived over the road from you – and who had been throwing stones at your windown for 10 years. You wouldn’t focus on his judgement but his inability to be considered a fair judge. The evidence you would bring to have the case thrown out would all be about the judge. This is not a difficult thing to grasp and lies at the root of all judicial systems. If impartiality is not there – nothing else matters.

      As for your long winded propaganda piece. I will just address the last one to expose how you work. You may be right, Pakistan has been mentioned 197 times. But qualititive and quantitive are not the same. Any REAL RESEACHER would say, okay – they’ve been mentioned – but is it criticism? Take the four visible research pieces on the page you linked to. All are in the count of Pakistan mentions. One is about climate change, one is a letter from the Pakistan PM and is about Sri Lanka, the third is about Covvid. Only TWO of the FOUR actually deals with Pakistan’s real human rights issues. The same is true about the news section, which just in the first few pages, contains numerous articles about Covvid or climate change. Unless Amnesty treat Israel in the same fashion – it means ‘numbers’ are not equal. (The best way propagandists deal with countering this, is to run off and find one example which works the other way – thus blurring the truth into nothingness.)

      Then – digging deeper – you ask further questions. Amnesty have branches everywhere. They all push their ‘news’. This creates a lot of news items about each issue. It allows Amnesty to hide their real bias. Because What Amnesty Pakistan say, has no meaning in the UK or US unless Amnesty HQ actually highlight it, turn it in to a campaign, bring it to the attention of those that matter – or better yet create real campaigns about it. And this is where the bias is exposed. When you check this, you see a real difference. Amnesty have far more energy for attacking Israel than they do anywhere else. It is because Amnesty’s noise is created by Amnesty’s people – so it comes down to whether Amnesty executives want to focus on a particular subject.

      Then there is the antisemitism – the unnatural hostility towards just one nation on earth. If you go through the Pakistan news – if you check output on Pakistan – if you see what Amnesty figures are tweeting about Pakistan – you notice sporadic pieces of positive news. There are absolutely no comparative items on Israel. Amnesty reserves its most hostile language for Israel – and only EVER speaks in negative terms.

      Not equal. Not even close. And all you do is grab a figure to try to push a lie. You are a troll, a propagandist – and you are not even a good one.

   2. There is a point here rarely made. People usually go down the cul de sac of settlements being a barrier to peace and similar batshit. The real point is they blow the ” safe haven ” thing out of the water.. There was a safe haven but the Zios weren’t safisfied. Everything beyond the green line is not the establishment of a safe haven it is simply kleptomania.

      In other words it is pointless adopting a position of anti zionism. It more that zionism had its chance and blew it. But fret not Israel will go the way of the Roman Empire, the Soviet Union and apartheid South Africa, and collapse under the weight of its internal contradictions. And then from the river to the sea. Palestine will be free.

      1. Ah Stehpen, bless.. ‘From the River to the Sea Palestine will be free’ – No freedom without first the destruction of Israel. The ideology that has left millions of Palestinians locked under the extremist rule of Islamist terror groups rather than enjoying freedom in a Palestinian state.. Every one who sings this phrase has helped destroy the freedom of a people.

         1. Hang on a sec.

            So when Stephen comes here every day saying “I couldn’t give a flying fuck about Jews and Israel,” he’s been fibbing all this time ?

            That is shocking.

         2. I dunno about that David but the bed Israel is lying on it made for itself

            1. Stephen and I agree again. Israel is the NASA approved memory foam mattress from Tempur; Comfort guaranteed for eternity.

      2. Just like it was nice to have the long-gone (and unlamented) Muck Framer finally lose his shit and defend Nazis, it’s nice to have something like you circle back to a zero-sum view you can’t possibly defend–but it sure makes for a swell troll point! I actually like this very slow and very stupid version of you, returning the points you make is like hitting a 2MPH tennis backhand shot.

   3. How someone who is so ignorant is prepared to take the time to post silly and easily refutable comments is beyond me. You clearly waste a lot of time that you obviously have at hand.

   4. Yeah–you didn’t make a single valid point in that post. Not that it’s unusual for you to miss the net by 30 meters every time, but you usually just fuck up once or twice instead of heading into double figures. It’s your keypad though, however you want to wear it out is your problem not ours.

9. Gabriel

   There is a saying ‘bullsh-t baffles brains’, and you are a specialist in scribling hundreds of words with your opinions masquerading as facts.

   You say that Palestinians don’t want to destroy Israel, but the Arabs of Mandatory Palestine who never called themselves Palestinians until the 1960’s, were committed to Israel’s destruction from the get go.

   What they tell there western ‘useful idiots’ in English is rather different to what they tell the Arab ‘street’ in Arabic.

   You should get translations of Arabic statements made by Palestinians from MEMRI and other sources to disabuse yourself of Palestinian innocence

   Between 1917 and 1948 the only people that called themselves Palestinian were the Jews of Mandatory Palestine. The Arabs of Mandatory Palestine called themselves Arabs of Southern Syria

10. Stephen

    So you are saying that Jordan never threatened the ‘safe haven’ when they started shelling Netanya at Israel’s narrowest point in 1967.

    Israel had requested through its contacts with Jordan to keep out of the coming war, but King Hussein for whatever reason found it expedient to attack, from the illegally occupied and annexed west bank.

    The Jewish communities in Judea and Samaria were only established after Jordans defeat in 1967. And never forget the total ethnic cleansing of all Jews in the area by the Jordanians after the 1948/9 war

11. Some further clarification in this extended thread. Israel has no responsibility to reward the failure of its enemies in their ambitions for Arab nationalism. Defeat has consequences and losers never dictate peace terms. Victors do. For further avoidance of doubt that is Israel.

    Again, I hope this helps clear things up

    1. the first one now will later be last

       hope this helps clear things up

    2. Thinking Ian could benfit from a crash course in determinism. After he’s sorted the O level chemistry thing of course. We wouldn’t want his head exploding.

       1. “So General Dayan, how do you account for another brilliant victory over 5 numerically superior Arab armies ?”

          “Well, we had superior intelligence, brilliant field commanders and highly motivated combat personnel. They had a few nonces typing shit on the internet. ”

          So Stephen, are you ready to get on your knees with Jack and apologise to me for backing the losers who still talk about eradicating my country ?

          1. I don’t give a flying fuck whether your country is eradicated or whether it isn’t.

             1. Calm down Stephen. It’s not important to anyone what you think. What’s important is that you’re here. A Stephen-less blog would be no fun at all.

                Are you blushing?

                1. I agree with you. It isn’t important to anyone what I think. But then I don’t have any sense of self importance. How about you ?

                   1. I’m still sniggering at your “From the river to the sea…” chant above. It’s taken you nearly a decade to wheel out that wind-up. Have you retired all your lickle rebel solja shtick ?

                      1. Ian I gave you that one. It is as well you and David are not fish you bite on every hook. But since you are so hung up on this Israel thing. Let me remind you. A life without cats would not be worth living. Miaow or how ever you spell it.

                2. Or we could bastardise the famous saying of Arrigo Sacchi. ” of course what Stephen Bellamy thinks isn’t important but it is the most important of the unimportant things” 0:)

12. Stephen

    The ‘bed Israel is lying in’ may be because of itself, but there have been an incredibly large group of Antisemites that have been very active in trying to destroy Israel (some even hoping to complete the work Hitler started. Lots of Nazis went to Arab countries after the war to help in their mutual desire to destroy the Jews)

13. The Amnesty report highlights the evil intent of Zionism which, as more and more people are beginning to understand, is the elimination of Palestinians from Palestine and replacing them through colonisation with Zionists. Anyone who has read Zionist literature by Jabotinsky and others knows perfectly well that this is the case. It is futile to appeal to Zionists to mend their ways, they know the truth and have been fully on board with the deception since 1948 and before. Many Jews inside Israel, particularly those who are not of European Zionist origin, know that this is the case and it is up to them and their children to put the situation right and help to fully democratise the Holy Land. Zionists will NEVER do it by choice. It is they who should be evicted, not those who believe in a fully democratic State with equality for all under the law.

    1. Hello Jack .

       Speaking as an extreme right wing Israeli Zio Jew, I confirm that you are not very appealing.

       To clarify, we do take a very dim view of those with intent to do us harm and have no qualms about neutralizing those threats. Internet warriors do not concern us.

       As a reminder, we are the victors of wars initiated by our enemies and they do not dictate terms in defeat. They should be on their knees begging our forgiveness as should you.

       1. Hello Ian

          Please forgive me for being curious. As far as you know, are you one of the indigenous Jews of the Holy Land or are you an immigrant or from immigrant stock?

          By the way, I have no wish to see you come to any harm, in fact the exact opposite. I wish you could live in peace with all your fellow occupants of the Holy Land.

          1. Hello Jack.

             Thank you for your direct engagement.

             Now, as you are a supporter of the Arab aggressors defeated by us in multiple conflicts and still sworn to eliminate Israel, are you ready to apologize to me for your bad decisions?

             1. Hi Ian,

                Immigrants to Palestine who refuse to recognise the rights of the indigenous people, have much in common with the Nazis who attempted to invade and colonise Britain. Had they done so, the British people, just like the Palestinians, would have done all they could to defend their land and homes and resist occupation. The Nazis, in an attempt to justify their cruelty, no doubt would then have claimed to have been victims of British terrorists.

                If you think that supporting people who are resisting occupation is a bad decision, it is probably pointless trying to have a reasonable conversation with you based upon normal moral standards.

                1. Hello Jack

                   Thank you for the continued direct dialogue.

                   For further clarification, Israel and the Israelis will dictate the terms of our victory and our future. We have no responsibility whatsoever to negotiate with defeated Arab foes whose aggressions in pursuit of their nationalist ambitions were crushed.

                   When you decide to seek our forgiveness and our support when the Islamic extremists start to come for you in the West, you know where I am.

                   1. Ian, because you as a Zionist went to Palestine uninvited and see the indigenous people in that land as enemies, it betrays a certain psychotic mind set on your part and as such it is impossible for me to have any meaningful conversation with you. I’m afraid that this also applies to the vast majority of Zionists and as such it means that Israel is a very mentally ill State.

                      1. Hello Jack,

                         Once again, I acknowledge your direct communication.

                         We can agree that we will never have a meaningful conversation. That is not why either of us our here. You visit to provoke some neurotic diaspora Jews. For me this is a home fixture so I dont need to do anything but see what you lot come up with and snigger dismissively from the eternal Jewish State. Imagine if you’d been keener on Jews and backed us. You’d be supporting a winning team.

                         1. Ian,
                            It should be obvious to you by now that I would never support a government or group which denied the human or civil rights of others, particularly when their purpose was to de-humanise them and steal their land and homes. The only reason that Palestinians feel any animosity towards you is not because you are Jewish, it is because they are fully aware that the Zionists’ intention is to drive them out of their own country. Zionism is NOT part of Judaism.

                            Never forget that there are many hundreds of thousand of Jews who completely reject Zionism and fully support the Palestinians in their struggle and that number is increasing day by day.

                            You may be unaware that here in the UK there is a determined effort to drive ELBIT, the Israeli arms manufacturer, out of our country by destroying the factories where they manufacture the apalling weapons used to kill Palestinians. The actions are being carried out and supported by brave Jews and non-Jews.

                            You are not part of a winning team, you are part of an odious Zionist regime which will be defeated by good people and go down in history as a reprehensible failed apartheid project.

14. Stephen

    Using your Dylan analogy, Jews have been the loser for nearly 2000 years, so maybe it is the chance of the Jews to be winners

    I suppose you are of the thinking that is gripping certain sectors of the anti-Israel, anti-Zionist and Antisemitic brigades that Jews managed to survive as their own masters for about 80 years at a time in previous ages, and that this situation will prevail again

    Just to let you know, we are working to ensure that this time we are planning for a much extended period

15. JackT

    Our resident Antisemite has returned after a brief hiatus. And he is still trying to define who Jews are. Still trying to divide us into Jews and Zionists. Still trying to define who are the ‘good’ Jews and the ‘bad Jews. That’s why you are an Antisemite JackT.

    And you are still too much of a coward to supply your full name

    1. Richard, ignoring your childish insults, are all Jews Zionists?

       1. “are all Jews Zionists?”

          The ones who have an instinct for survival certainly are….

          I guess that would be most of us?

          👍

16. JackT

    Our resident Antisemite and coward because he/she refuses to use their full name

    Who is indigenous to the Holy Land otherwise known as The Land of Israel, as detailed in at least 3500 years of history in the bible, historical commentators over two and a half millennia, and even the Quran.

    UNRWA says Palestinian refugees are those Arabs who can prove they were resident in the area for ONLY two years prior to Israel’s rebirth in May 1948. So Arabs from Mandatory Palestine could, and did, arrive over the course of British rule, drawn by the employment opportunities created by Jewish commerce and industry. The British, as true colonialists, couldn’t tell who among the Arabs were recent arrivals and those who had been there longer and couldn’t speak Arabic either, never bothered keeping proper records of the Arab population

    And thus, beiing resident for two years prior to May 1948 is really the defining factor in Palestinian Arab indigenousity to the area

    1. Richard, you said I was trying to creat a division between Jews and Zionists, therefore I ask again, are all Jews Zionists?

       1. Hello Jack,

          I commend your new approach of direct dialogue here though it must be tedious always being on the back foot in these posts.

          Think about it. Israel and the Israelis have their victory, their country, their freedom and their prosperity and you’re still tapping it out on the internet asking “who’s who?”

          Hope you’re a patient soul. You’ll be doing this until you die.

17. JackT

    Our resident Antisemite and coward because he will not use his full name

    What a perfectly silly question.
    Nobody ever claimed that all Jews are Zionist, just as not all Zionists are Jews

18. JackT

    Our resident Antisemite and coward because he will not use his full name

    I said you are trying to define who are Zionists and who are Jews.

    I am saying that most Zionists are Jews, and most Jews are Zionists.

    A major difference between us

    1. Thank you Richard for confirming you accept there is a division between those Jews who are Zionists and those Jews who are not Zionists. It is a division which has been there for decades, created by Zionists. As you also know, Zionism is not part of Judaism and was rejected by those Jews who see the inherent evil in Zionism and its apartheid. It is Jews themselves who have decided who is good and who is bad among them.

       “If I don’t steal your house, someone else will steal it” Said the American Zionist to a Palestinian lady.

       1. ” Attack our country with your Arab armies and we’ll crush them again ” said the Israeli Zionist victors.

          Remember this Jack. The winners dictate the terms. The losers and their fans get to whine on the internet.

          1. Ian, if you think thugs are winners, I doubt your sanity.

             1. Hello Jack,

                Thank you for your concern but as we both know, you can’t make an omelette without cracking eggs. Israelis are world class omelette makers.

                When you’re ready to apologise to me for your malicious intent, your feigned support for vicious Arab aggression and your studied provocations of hapless diaspora Jews, I may send you the recipe.

    2. The criteria that makes Jack T an antisemite is that Stinky Dick Galber simply disagrees with him.

       1. Sounds like a reliable definition Brucie. Thanks for sharing.

          1. FROM THE STUDY OF THE DEPUTY CHIEF RABBI

             STOP PRESS

             After years of study, Chief Rabbi Dreck has declared that it’s IMPOSSIBLE for those of the Jewish faith to be antisemitic.

             ###

             “An un-G*dly, tactic used by you Zionist vermin, ad infinitum, is to accuse people who criticize apartheid Israel of being antisemitic

             Seems to be a way of putting people on the defensive and shutting them up.

             It won’t work with these Rabbis.”

             Chief Rabbi Dr Dreck

             Deputy Chief Rabbi Dr Levy

             1. Loonster Levy…..

                is not a doctor….

                is not a Rabbi…..

                is not a Mayer (whatever that is…..)

                He is just a bit of a c@nt……and a deluded one at that…..

                And that……is all………

19. JackT

    Most European Jews that were opposed to Zionism died by Hitler’s bullets and gas chambers.

    Most of the Jews and their descendants who were expelled and ethnically cleansed from the Arab and Muslim lands in the mid-twentieth century are the most ardent Zionists

20. ‘Boxcar Brucie’

    The fake rabbi and serial Holocaust denigrator and revisionist

    Stinky Dick Galber totally disagrees with you

    Stinky Dick Galber thinks you are also Antisemite as a result of the language you employ

21. JackT

    As our resident Antisemite, if you think all Zionists are psychotic and you can’t have a conversation with them, why do you find it so difficult to avoid return time and again to this site to leave posts and engage in conversation with Zionists

    Maybe perchance under the circumstances it’s you that is psychotic

22. JackT

    Of course Zionism is part of Judaism

    From the very beginning of Judaism until the present, the desire and necessity to return and go up to Jerusalem and Zion is hard wired into the religion.

    Abraham, Moses, even the Jewish Jesus Christ and all the other prophets and Jewish kings and rulers made Jerusalem and Zion their religous and spiritual centre

    There is definitely a debate in Judaism about the method and timing of the return to Jerusalem. But if one doesn’t recognise the centrality and importance of Jerusalem and Zion, I find it very difficult to see how they could claim to be Jewish

23. ‘Boxcar Brucie’ the pretend rabbi and serial Holocaust revisionist and denigrator

    ‘Stinky Dick Galber’ , just wanting to know where and which denomination your ‘chief rabbi dreck’ belongs?

    He’s not part of the Simpsons cartoon in Springfield as well is he?

24. Hello Jack,

    Thank you for sustaining this direct dialogue into a second and third day.

    You are a Brit ? I trust that you are actively lobbying your government to cancel the multi £bn orders placed with us by your armed services for the advanced weaponary made in our odious Zionist factories?

    You’re on the back foot here again. You are repelled by Israel but you can’t keep your shrinking and inferior military on a level playing field with the threats it faces without us and our superior technology and intelligence.

    If you want to beg for my forgiveness for lauding Arab terror and screaming for my destruction, I may even send you over some of our Mossad dolphins.

    1. “If you want to beg for my forgiveness for lauding Arab terror and screaming for my destruction, I may even send you over some of our Mossad dolphins.”

       I think you are losing it Ian 🙂 but thank you for giving me this opportunity to show normal people who may stumble accross this blog how unhinged Zionists are.

       1. Irony not your thing huh Jack ?

          Was that a bit to subtle for a Corbyn cultist like yourself ?

          Lets face it…….your lot are not known for being the sharpest tolls in the box……?

          Ah well……never mind……..

          Mossad dolphins…..hehehehe……

25. JackT

    Of course Zionism is part of Judaism

    From the very beginning of Judaism until the present, the desire and necessity to return and go up to Jerusalem and Zion is hard wired into the religion.

    Abraham, Moses, even the Jewish Jesus Christ and all the other prophets and Jewish kings and rulers made Jerusalem and Zion their religous and spiritual centre

    There is definitely a debate in Judaism about the method and timing of the return to Jerusalem. But if one doesn’t recognise the centrality and importance of Jerusalem and Zion, I find it very difficult to see how they could claim to be Jewish

    1. Richard, it’s quite obvious you have no clue about the term ‘Zionism’ you probably do not even have a clear undestanding of ‘Zion’. Could I suggest that you check out the writings of Nathan Birnbaum who first coined the term Zionism. Hint, it was much less than two thousand years ago 🙂

       Many religions have places which are sacred and holy to them but they certainly do not invade them and slaughter the indigenous inhabitants as Zionists do, at least those who are civilised don’t. If you say that these actions are part of the Jewish religion, then it is you and other Zionists who think the same who are the antiSemites, shame on you.

       Oh, and by the way, Jesus was a Palestinian who genetically had more in common with present day Palestinians, than do European Zionists.

       1. “Jesus was a Palestinian who genetically had more in common with present day Palestinians, than do European Zionists.”

          Thank-you for that lesson on genetic purity Doctor Goebbels…..

          Racist much ?????????

26. This is what total victory looks like for Zionist Jews; we get to look out on our fantastic country as it flourishes and thrives in safety and security. Our Arab enemies scramble in their rubble, misfiring homemade rockets, and attempt to stab young mums and nans in the street. The activists that pretend to support them are left tapping out “I’m a Rabbi, honest” on the internet.

    1. Ian, as a Zionist outsider it’s not your country and it flourished with green fields, olive trees, orchards and orange groves long before you invaded it. Zionist myths have addled your brain.

       1. Hello Jack,

          Thank you for another direct engagement here and whilst the content was obviously insincere I am sure that some of the more sensitive diaspora Jews would have found it quite provocative, so well done you.

          To me, your impotence screams out like a thunderclap. Israel’s record of decisive victories against Arab aggression has been demoralising and humiliating for our defeated foes and when they shrivel as pawns in your eternal fight against Jews, the best you have is to come here and squeal ” Its not yours. It’s not. It’s not”. Next you’ll be bleating ” I’m a Rabbi, honest” .

          As I said earlier in our exchange, I hope you’ve got the stomach for a long shift. You’re going to be at this for life.

          1. Ian, you are part of a band of Zionist thieves and no amount of ‘it’s mine and I’m keeping it’ bravado will change that. Thieves can conjure up all sorts of excuses for their crimes but in the end, they are still thieves!

             1. Hello Jack,

                I really do commend your commitment to this direct exchange notwithstanding the rather rude tone you have adopted towards me. Lucky I’m not one of your super-edgy diaspora Jew readers. Then I’d feel very very provoked.

                Anyway, setting aside your faux angst, howdya see this one playing out for you ? We’ve got our country, our global allies our multi $bn clients and we are growing stronger and better connected all the time. You have a keyboard and a quota of “apartheid”, “ZioNazi” and “genocide” content to post on the daily. Reckon you have the fortitude to continue your project for the rest of your life?

                1. Hi Ian, my earlier reply to you seems to have disappeared? but I said you are getting a little upset because I truthfully referred to you as part of a gang of Zionist thieves and that the answer to your discomfort is simple, leave the gang.

                   I also said that no matter how disgruntled you feel, it can never match the pain and suffering that you and your gang have inflicted upon the Palestinians by murdering them and stealing their land and homes.

                   As Zionists always do, you are trying to play the part of the victims but the world is getting wise to your crimes and eventually, Zionists will be on the stage alone.

                   1. “eventually, Zionists will be on the stage alone”

                      Yeh right…..

                      The simple truth is that more countries are trading with Israel than ever before and these numbers are growing not shrinking….

                      So exactly how do you see a future Palestinian state replacing the current Israeli one ?

                      What course of events do you foresee taking place for that to happen ?

                      Please be specific…..or as specific as possible…..

                      Many thanks…..

27. JackT

    This is the real story of the Holy Land

    A crash course on history of PALESTINIAN STATE:
    1. Before Israel, there was a British mandate, not a Palestinian state
    2. Before the British Mandate, there was the Ottoman Empire, not a Palestinian state.
    3. Before the Ottoman Empire, there was the Islamic state of the Mamluks of Egypt, not a Palestinian state.
    4. Before the Islamic state of the Mamluks of Egypt, there was the Ayubid Arab-Kurdish Empire, not a Palestinian state.
    5. Before the Ayubid Empire, there was the Frankish and Christian Kingdom of Jerusalem, not a Palestinian state.
    6. Before the Kingdom of Jerusalem, there was the Umayyad and Fatimid empires, not a Palestinian state.
    7. Before the Umayyad and Fatimid empires, there was the Byzantine empire, not a Palestinian state.
    8. Before the Byzantine Empire, there were the Sassanids, not a Palestinian state.
    9. Before the Sassanid Empire, there was the Byzantine Empire, not a Palestinian state.
    10. Before the Byzantine Empire, there was the Roman Empire, not a Palestinian state.
    11. Before the Roman Empire, there was the Hasmonean state, not a Palestinian state.
    12. Before the Hasmonean state, there was the Seleucid, not a Palestinian state.
    13. Before the Seleucid empire, there was the empire of Alexander the Great, not a Palestinian state.
    14. Before the empire of Alexander the Great, there was the Persian empire, not a Palestinian state.
    15. Before the Persian Empire, there was the Babylonian Empire, not a Palestinian state.
    16. Before the Babylonian Empire, there were the Kingdoms of Israel and Judah, not a Palestinian state.
    17. Before the Kingdoms of Israel and Judah, there was the Kingdom of Israel, not a Palestinian state.
    18. Before the kingdom of Israel, there was the theocracy of the twelve tribes of Israel, not a Palestinian state.
    19. Before the theocracy of the twelve tribes of Israel, there was an agglomeration of independent Canaanite city-kingdoms, not a Palestinian state.
    20. Actually, in this piece of land there has been everything, EXCEPT A PALESTINIAN STATE.
    Feel free to use this for the uneducated

    1. Brilliant. And where exactly does the genocide of the canaanites fit in ? Oh yeah between 18 and 19.

       But apart from that thank you for confirming that we live in a deterministic universe and nothing is forever. Psst don’t tell Ian this you will only upset him

       1. Let’s see it through your and my lifetimes first Stephen and then all your lickle rebel soljas can take over daddy’s duties for themselves. For all the mini Ians it will be a welcome break from ‘neutralizing’ Arab stabbers in eternal Israel.

          1. Oh yeah eternal Israel I heard about that

             daddy’s duties

             I assume by daddy you are refering to the Great Real Estate Agent In the Sky ?

             1. Oh yeah. Forgot that invisible men were your thing, Stephen. Very telling.

             2. “we live in a deterministic universe and nothing is forever.”

                Very true Bellers….

                How long did the 1,000 year Reich last for?

                About 12 years wasn’t it?

                😁

                Ah well….never mind….

    2. Hey Stinky Dick Galber, what Zionist Hasbara website did you plagerize that from?

28. JackT

    And every time there was a new empire ruling the area they brought their language and people with them.

    And the Jews have been there from the beginning. Proof of that is in one of the oldest books in the world, the BIBLE

    1. Richard, the Bible is not a history book, neverthless I’ve never doubted the history of the Jews. However, the Jews were not alone in Palestine and the relatives of all those who were there since the ‘beginning’ should have equal rights now. Zionists who arrived from Europe in the nineteenth century are determined not to recognise those rights.

       1. Hello Jack,

          Full marks for sticking with your change of style here and talking to rather than about us Zios and Israelis. Well done again you.

          They do say “might is right” Jack. You can’t argue that our superior and victorious IDF continues to prove that point.

          1. Hi Ian, thank you for your acknowledgement. With your self-proclaimed superior intelligence, surely you must have realised by now that my interaction with both yourself and Richard is hopefully to reach a wider audience, assuming that is that this blog has readers other than a few nerds like us. So thank you again for this opportunity. I may drop in now and again just to see how you are getting along.

             1. Hello Jack.

                You have tactics? Well good for you.

                Hope you, your best friends who are Jewish (natch) and your many followers caught our fab Tzipy last night. I’m a huge fan, obvs. Her support for the formalisation of our sovereignty over Judea and Samaria is sensible and will actually benefit not only Israel but all the Arabs that you pretend to support. I’m sure that those that don’t fancy living in the Jewish State will be welcomed with open arms by you Brits. I hear Luton is charming.

29. ‘Boxcar Brucie Levy’ the fake rabbi and serial Holocaust denigrator and revisionist

    Have you got a different timeline, dimwit.
    The evidence is from multiple sources, which does include the Bible, the history of Egypt, Rome, the Greeks and the Persians amongst others.

    This is literally the history of the Eastern Mediterranean basin, you ignorant dimwit

    If you were a real Rabbi you would be aware of these facts.

    1. Brucie’s barely even a real shelf stacker, Richard but I don’t want to be too mean to him. This is his life’s work after all, so he’s gonna be here a while yet.

    2. You’re a GAS, Stinky Dick Galber.

30. JackT

    Jews have always had to stand alone

    As the Jewish Sages of the past have said; there will always arise in every generation some leader and/or state that will come along and call for the destruction of the Jews. All the anti-Jewish Antisemitic bigots of today have just changed their target from the Jews to Israel. Once they were against the Jewish religion, then it was against the Jewish people, and now it’s against the Jewish State
    .
    And I call you an Antisemite because you are forever telling us who and what Jews are

    And Jesus Christ was a a Jew in Judea, and he prayed at the Jewish Temple in Jerusalem while it was under Roman occupation. And there was no Palestine then. Study some history

    1. Richard, in order to attempt to justify their occupation of Palestine and slaughter of Palestinians, Zionists have had to try and impress upon Jews a feeling of being victimised. They are constantly trying to make Jews feel unsafe so that they will look upon Israel as a refuge. This is the cruel subterfuge which is being practiced by Zonists upon Jews. Not one of my Jewish friends feels unsafe in the UK and in fact, the only attacks against them have been from Zionists because they will not follow the Zionist line. In one case, the attacks were physical. In Jerusalem I witnessed attacks by Zionists upon orthodox Jews who reject Zionism. In the nineteenth century, many indigenous Jews in Palestine, who were living peacefully with their neighbours of other religions, correctly forsaw the problems that the Zionist colonisers from Europe would bring.

       You may refer to me as an antiSemite but it doesn’t bother me one bit. As a term of abuse, Zionists have devalued it by slinging it at anyone with whom they disagree.

       I recommend that you throw off your Zionist myths and version of history and do some genuine research, you will find that the true history of Palestine goes back more than four thousand years. Even if you look at relatively modern history of the last few hundred years, you can find the remains of Palestinian towns and villages, obliterated by Zionist terrorists, which had Jewish and Islamic places of worship almost next to each other, where those who wished, could practice their religion without fear. If you don’t believe me, book one of the Zochrot tours.

       1. Funny how Libtards like Jack think that all Israeli Zionists are white Europeans?

          🙄

          What tw@ts they are…..

          🙄

          1. More nonsense from silly Ken Dobkin, another ignorant Zionist. I have never been under the impression that white Europeans have any monopoly on Zionism but it was in Europe where the evil movement began and from where the plan to colonise Palestine against the wishes of local Jews and Moslems was launched.

             1. Yes I’m sure that European Jews not having a safe haven to flee to did absolutely nothing to help Hitler systematically murder 6m of us (including members of my own extended family) in the Holocaust?

                🙄

                “evil movement” ???

                Wtaf ???

                🙄

                But as it happens I actually had quite an evil movement myself after a few beers and a curry last Saturday night….

                😝

                The stench it gave off reminded me of you…

                😁

                1. Ken, more ignorance from you for anyone reading this little blog to see. The colonisation of Palestine by Zionists started way before the Holocaust. If there is one thing you can rely upon from Zionists such as Ken Dobkin, it’s crudity.

                   1. Yes it’s true that European Jewish IMMIGRATION to Ottoman controlled and then BRITISH controlled Palestine began before the Holocaust.

                      However due to Arab pressure the Jewish immigration quota was reduced to just 10,000 per year! And when WW2 started this was reduced to ZERO!

                      So thanks to Arab bigotry and British bureaucracy many many more European Jews died in the gas chambers of Auschwitz than needed to….

                      Sure makes you proud to be British huh?

                      🙄

          2. Zionists are the white devils. Period.

             How many non-white Europeans hold senior positions of power in the apartheid state?

             But remember, even though Zionists are the white devils, good will always triumph over evil.

             1. “good will always triumph over evil.”

                It already has…

                😁

                1. Not yet in apartheid Israel, Dopey Dobkin.

                   1. ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

                      Not a Rabbi…..

                      Not a Doctor…….

                      Not a Mayer…………

                      Just a tw@t………….

                      And that……….is all……….

31. Morning all. I hear that our Tzipy was terrific last night and took fewer prisoners than the IDF during a raid on an Arab terror cell in Judea and Samaria. The UK’s white academic elite are an enthusiastic audience. Pity that most of them were outside rudely screaming their hostility to Jews whilst pretending to support Arabs. Chinless inbred wimps.

    1. Ah, Tzipy, the fragrant war criminal. Any hostility was towards Zionists such as her, not Jews.

       1. Not the brightest are you Jacky lad?

          🙄

          Have Squawkbox banned you by any chance ?

          🙄

          1. Ian, is Dozy Dobkin one of those idiot Zionists you spoke about?

             1. Hello Jack.

                I am thrilled that you’re now here on the daily. Just for the exercise you should re-read your contributions from the start of this episode until now. You can’t fail to notice the huge shift I style and I wonder what you make of it.

                Gone is the old Jack who had no interest in direct engagement and just chucked his proactive little grenade into the room to wind up a few neurotic diaspora Jews. Now you’re full-on with all the activist tropes and tactics; silly nicknames, the full archive of slogans. Did one of your team hand you the playbook?

                That’s the thing about this place. Opponents get drawn in and eventually morph into this repetitive, pointless posting bot, like Chris, the late Michael, Charles and more latterly Brucie. I give you 2 years at best. Enjoy the ride boychik.

                1. TWO YEARS! there’s no way I could be in the company of thieves for that long but as I said, I may drop in now and again to thrill you and Dirty Dobkin.

                   1. Hello Jack,

                      I had assumed that chaps with sincerely held convictions like you need to act on them and for you this means writing things in comment sections on the internet. For this reason I am sure that we will be speaking again here quite regularly.

                      I’m off now to do some of that apartheid with my mate the Arab dentist; 9 holes at Caesarea golf club where, of the 2 of us he’s the only one who can afford the membership.

             2. Yep….

                Squawkbox must have banned him….

                😁😝😂

          2. Hey “Ken,” you white Zio devil, ” YOU were BANNED by The Guardian.

             Pot and kettle come to mind.

             1. Yes true

                But I just set up a new account…

                So when I post there now I just pretend to be a Doctor and a Rabbi and Mayer of London who defends violence against Jews and denigrates the Holocaust….

                They seem to like me now…..

                🙄 😁 😉 😕 😝

32. JackT seems to be a rerun of Michael Farmer and Charles Albbern/Alburn???.

    Farmer was forever trying to define Jews and tell us who we are.

    And Charles was just an out and out Antisemitic anti-Jewish bigot by his own admission and who plied us constantly with conspiracy theories

    At least Michael and Charles had the courage to use their full names, unlike the cowardly JackT who hides behind anonymity

33. JackT

    Please could you show, and share any information that in any way shows that Jesus Christ was a Palestinian.

    First you need to show me evidence that there was ever a Palestinian people, other than in the twentieth century, and where the capital of a Palestinian state was, and what currency they used, and what were the names of their leaders.

    Please don’t refer to modern writers who have accepted the Palestinians narrative hook, line and sinker, so when they address ancient history they use modern terms/names in instead of those names and terms which were actually used at the time

34. JackT

    Back to Birunbaum, or whatever. One source of information is not fact. So what if he was supposedly the originator of the term Zionism, which I doubt; what difference does it make

    Zionism with whatever name you want to call it has existed for as long as the Jewish people.

    Also you claim Israel and Zionists slaughter people to conquer their country. Less people on both sides of the Arab/Israeli conflict have died in over a hundred years of this current particular little conflict than have died in the Syrian civil war over ten years. And a few thousand Palestinians have died/been murdered in Syria in that time.

    But hey, no Jews; so no interest from those who I call the ‘progressive lefty liberal neo-fascists of the western world’.

    1. Have you spotted how our Jack is an engager now Richard? He still fills his quota of “apartheid” words as his team requires, but he’s also trying his hand at some tactics from their playbook. Personally, I don’t see him having that level of commitment to the cause and he will probably fizzle out like a Hamas rocket in a Sderot kindergarten playground. It will be fun watching, as always.

35. Hey David, My local ASDA sold out of the Zionist Bullshit Spray. Do you think the Co-op may have any in stock?

    Now if you’ll excuse me, I’ve got to 🙏✡️

    1. Good news there Brucie. Sales are up. Thanks for the stock control update. Are we calling this a BDS fail?

       1. You mean BDS WIN!

          The Zionist Bullshit Spray cleans and destroys Zionist Bullshit in seconds. Removes Zionist lies and Hasbara too!

          Never mind, I picked up a few cans of ZBS at Sainsbury’s.

          1. Buying a product made by Teva Brucie? Zios selling to anti-Zios and nabbing our Brucie’s hard earned shilling. Classic Israel.

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